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Statuses

Hi folks! I'm facing some problems or maybe just concepts I don't understand...
Since last year, I just got Trados packages (I'm not a freelancer anymore and Trados is the way to go for where I work now). Till now, I've been working with memoQ as I really hate Trados Terminology Management, which is crucial for my job. I've found some free time this weekend to make some tests before I make the switch to CT from memoQ (its workflow adds too many steps to work with Trados files) but I'm getting crazy with the "segment behavior":


Confirmed segments (from Trados) are Approved segments in CT (OK) but, when segments are just drafted from Trados side, are they "translated" in CT (it seems there's no draft state)? To clarify, how can we draft segments in CT? I mean, once I get into a segment and type something, if I leave this segment, how can I know it is a draft (edited or whatever) instead of a confirmed translation from myself? Is there a "shortcut" for "Add APPROVED segments to memory and go to next untranslated segments"? Because, If I use the approved status while translating to differentiate between drafts and confirmed, still If I leave a segment just drafted, the approved status imposes.


Dude, this is kind hard to guess, I'm afraid once I finish a project, my drafts can be considered as translations and that could be really bad.


Hello,

Below you will find some SDL Trados Statuses as they are displayed in CafeTran.


Draft and no Status are displayed as being the same, but cannot be mistaken for Signed-off or Translated.


However, CafeTran does NOT match Translator approved (the status used by proofreaders/reviewers) to a specific status, so that's a problem there. I have already raised the need for a CT match concerning this status, as it is one of the most important ones in SDL Trados.


I suggest you assign Approved segments the lock status in SDL Trados, before opening in CT. Alternatively, if to be translated segments have empty target, filter non empty segments and lock them in CT, the lock is only active for the CafeTran session.


When you hit Finalize in CafeTran, note all segments get the Translated status, so if you don't want that, Filter segments and change status selectively via the Task menu,


When you export to package, segments also get the Translated status. Possible workaround discussed here: https://cafetran.freshdesk.com/support/discussions/topics/6000055024


Cheers,



Thanks a lot Jean Dimitriadis!

I still see the problem, actually, the real problem is not linked to Trados files but to  every file format (I don't really work with Trados packages because I must finish the projects on Trados cause of QA stuff, so I work directly with sdlxliff).

  • Scenario 1: I open the sdlxliff in CT, it has to be translated and, once it's finished, I need to see it as Translator Confirmed (for me, it means when you use CTRL+ENTER in Trados/memoQ) in Trados, so, to achieve this, I need to use "Approved" status from CT side, Ok, this is amazing cause the "Approved" status offers a clear way to know whether it's gonna look as "CTRL+ENTER" in Trados.
           Problem 1: When I'm translating, I use to go segment by segment, translating and confirming (CTRL+ENTER, for Trados and memoQ, ALT-DOWN for CT). Sometimes it happens I'm not sure about a specific term in a segment, so I just jump to the next and keep it for later. In Trados/memoQ, I just use arrows to move between segments which is supposed to be ALT-LEFT/RIGHT in CT. Now, as there's no shortcut for "confirming", I need to work in Approve "mode" (switch the little pop-up to Approve instead of Translate), why, if I type in a segment that I don't want to confirm but to keep it for later, and then I go to the next segment via  ALT-RIGHT it becomes Approved instantly even if the segment is kept empty? This makes me: a) not to Approve segments till the end via Tasks>Approve all segments, which is not an option cause I can't then distinguish between Translated and Drafts/Untranslated (i.e. no status mark but no empty segment), b) work in "Approve mode" (i.e. with Approve in the little pop-up menu below the segment editor On), being aware that if I jump to another segment while I haven't finished the current one yet it will set the current one to Approve even if it's not. 

There's a "solution" when it comes to "Checked status", as there's a shortcut for "Check current segment and go to the next untranslated one", I'm not supposed to work in "Check mode", if I want it checked, I use the shortcut, if I want to leave it as a draft/untranslated, I just go to the next one via ALT-RIGHT, the checked one will keep in gray and the draft/untranslated one will stay the same as before typing on it, why don't we have another shortcut for "Confirm as translated segment" that shows a mark that actually stands for TRANSLATED/CONFIRMED BY TRANSLATOR (not proofreader) (that would be the broadly used CTRL-ENTER in every other tool)? So that, we could have:
- NO mark for drafted/edited/untranslated segments
- Translated/Confirmed my translator mark for actually REAL translations, those you don't need to come back to because they're already OK
- Checked/Approve mark (actually, I don't see the difference between these) for Proofreading.

Why "Approved/Checked" segments are not autopropagate to all repetition of that segment?

Maybe it's me who is missing something, maybe I just don't get the workflow in CT or maybe CT has the least convenient editor I've ever seen in my life, anyway, this is making me not using CT almost since a year. But this is not only for Trados files as I said, it happens with every file, I think it's the editor behavior itself.



For example, in this screenshot, the segment no. 7 is supposed to be translated (i.e., I got into it, typed my translation, then ALT-DOWN) but there isn't a mark to distinguish it from the segment no. 9, which is a segment I came into, typed some stuff but not recorded to TM cause I'm still not sure if I want definitely that translation and then left via ALT-LEFT/RIGHT.

(It's a Word file, by the way).


image

Hello,


I found your post a little confusing, I'll try to address some of your points.


I still see the problem, actually, the real problem is not linked to Trados files but to every file format (I don't really work with Trados packages because I must finish the projects on Trados cause of QA stuff, so I work directly with sdlxliff).


Just FYI, you can export to Package, not just to Return package in CafeTran, which means the package can be open in SDL Trados. For your situation, it is better to use the SDLXLIFFs as you do.


Scenario 1: I open the sdlxliff in CT, it has to be translated and, once it's finished, I need to see it as Translator Confirmed (for me, it means when you use CTRL+ENTER in Trados/memoQ) in Trados, so, to achieve this, I need to use "Approved" status from CT side, Ok, this is amazing cause the "Approved" status offers a clear way to know whether it's gonna look as "CTRL+ENTER" in Trados.


Translator Confirmed = This is probably a MemoQ status, not an SDL Trados status (also, what version of Studio are you using?). Let's keep it clear, and focus on only one tool comparison with regards to statuses. Do you mean "Translation Approved" or ""Translated" in Studio?


Here is a list of translation statuses in Studio (2019).


Obviously, the use of segment statuses is arbitrary to some extent, but "Translation Approved" is typically meant for the Reviewer.


I think segment statuses in SDL Trados have this scenario in mind:

Translator (Draft, Translated)

Reviewer/Proofreader (Translation Approved, Translation Rejected, with or without Track changes)

LQA or PM (Sign-off Approved/Rejected) 

Lock statuses are for generally for PM use.


So, I'm I right that you want to work in three statuses? Draft, Translated and Translation Approved?


If this is true, you are already using SDL Trados in a non typical scenario, probably due to the fact you are working in-house.


As I said (please refer to my original screenshot), unless mistaken, "Translation Approved" is NOT matched by CafeTran, a Translation Approved segment in SDL Trados does not have a differentiated status and appears as an edited segment. I would like to see CafeTran match this status, but is not a problem for you, since you can set this status when you open the translation back in Studio.


In Studio, Ctrl+Enter changes function, depending if you are using the "Open for Translation", "Open for Review", or "Open for Sign-off" modes. In the "Open for Translation" mode, Ctrl+Enter gives the "Translated", and it gives "Translation Approved" in the "Open for Review" mode. What mode are you using in Studio when you say you use Ctrl+Enter?


           Problem 1: When I'm translating, I use to go segment by segment, translating and confirming (CTRL+ENTER, for Trados and memoQ, ALT-DOWN for CT). Sometimes it happens I'm not sure about a specific term in a segment, so I just jump to the next and keep it for later. In Trados/memoQ, I just use arrows to move between segments which is supposed to be ALT-LEFT/RIGHT in CT. Now, as there's no shortcut for "confirming", I need to work in Approve "mode" (switch the little pop-up to Approve instead of Translate), why, if I type in a segment that I don't want to confirm but to keep it for later, and then I go to the next segment via ALT-RIGHT it becomes Approved instantly even if the segment is kept empty? This makes me: a) not to Approve segments till the end via Tasks>Approve all segments, which is not an option cause I can't then distinguish between Translated and Drafts/Untranslated (i.e. no status mark but no empty segment), b) work in "Approve mode" (i.e. with Approve in the little pop-up menu below the segment editor On), being aware that if I jump to another segment while I haven't finished the current one yet it will set the current one to Approve even if it's not. 


There's a "solution" when it comes to "Checked status", as there's a shortcut for "Check current segment and go to the next untranslated one", I'm not supposed to work in "Check mode", if I want it checked, I use the shortcut, if I want to leave it as a draft/untranslated, I just go to the next one via ALT-RIGHT, the checked one will keep in gray and the draft/untranslated one will stay the same as before typing on it, why don't we have another shortcut for "Confirm as translated segment" that shows a mark that actually stands for TRANSLATED/CONFIRMED BY TRANSLATOR (not proofreader) (that would be the broadly used CTRL-ENTER in every other tool)? So that, we could have:


- NO mark for drafted/edited/untranslated segments


- Translated/Confirmed my translator mark for actually REAL translations, those you don't need to come back to because they're already OK


- Checked/Approve mark (actually, I don't see the difference between these) for Proofreading.



Yes, the developer could add two new actions "Add Approved segment to memory and go to the next segment" and "Add Approved segment to memory and go to the next not Approved segment", but I think Approved is just for use with Trados files and packages. No need to use it otherwise, Checked is doing the work fine.


So, why not just apply the Approved status in the end? Hitting the Finalize button does just that. It sets the translated status to all segments. For selectively setting the Approved status, filter the segments and apply it via the Task menu WITHOUT Finalizing.


Why "Approved/Checked" segments are not autopropagate to all repetition of that segment?


I think they should auto-propagate, even in Approved, Checked status. I'm not sure, since I don't use these statuses much, but otherwise, why would there be a setting "Auto-propagation from locked segments" in Preferences > Auto-propagation in CTE?


If working with multiple files, make sure you use the Glue mode in CafeTran, otherwise auto-propaggation works for the current file only. Also, make sure Checked segments are not set to be skipped in Action > Skip submenu.


Maybe it's me who is missing something, maybe I just don't get the workflow in CT or maybe CT has the least convenient editor I've ever seen in my life, anyway, this is making me not using CT almost since a year. But this is not only for Trados files as I said, it happens with every file, I think it's the editor behavior itself.


CafeTran already offers great interoperability features, that few tools can match. I think we're doing it a disservice if we discuss its features or convenience always in comparison to other tools, that CafeTran would then need to match, in terms of features, of behavior, etc.


I don't know if you are missing something, but I suggest you first see what you can do with the available features.


For example, yeah, Ctrl+Enter is generally used for confirming a Translated segment. But the shortcut was previously associated with a major CafeTran feature (which regrettably is now by default given the more obscure Ctrl+Shift+G shortcut - which I assign to Add to Glossary): Default Scope! I still use Ctrl+Enter for Default scope, as I use it all the time. Yes, Default scope allows you to search the Web resources (or any other type of resource, that is selected on the right when you open the advanced Search and Replace window - Ctlr+F). Initiate in an instant a web search on the currently selected web resource tab. Quickly navigate between tabs with Ctlr+, and Ctlr+. Rearrange tabs so that those you query often are next to each other. WHAT'S NOT TO LIKE? This is what happens when you work with a specific tool and leverage its own features, instead of trying to replicating the exact same workflow you use in other tools. 


I too often work with SDLXLIFFs and Packages, and too deliver my translations with the Studio "Translated" status.


So, here is what I do:


I just happily translate the text and simply go to next translated or next untranslated segment. Why bother with statuses at this point? Approved status will be attributed when I'm done with the translation anyway.


Some use the Checked status in CafeTran, I don't bother using that either. If was a CafeTran proofreader, or working on an already (fully or partly) translated document, this is what I would use.


I always review my work from start to finish when I'm done (with smaller in-translation reviews to make sure the text flows between segments), and the QA is completed in the end (along with Export to bilingual document, to use an external proofreading tool linked to Word/LibreOffice).


So, what happens if I want to leave a segment partly translated, or indicate it requires some special attention even before the final review stage?


Well, I use a handy CafeTran feature that is more or less a pain to use in Studio: CafeTran Notes (Comments in SDL Trados). Just press Alt+T. Any selected text is automatically added to the Note. By adding notes, you not only mark a segment as needing attention, you can add specific information regarding what you need to check, what part of the text is causing trouble or requires further documentary search or confirmation, etc. While browsing the Grid, it is super easy to distinguish segment with Notes, from segments without Notes. There is a Filter action for filtering only Segments with Notes, so you can focus on these at any time. There is also a Task action that lets you delete all notes in the end, without having to delete them individually if you don't have to. And, last but not least, if you want to file queries to your client, you can do so by Project > Export and exchange > Export as bilingual document with notes, before removing Notes from the project. Thusly, you can just share the bilingual review and explain the queries can be found at the segment level in the attached bilingual doc.


I'm sorry, but I think this is a lot better than just distinguishing between Draft and Translated statuses.


Using the "Checked" status is also a solution. Yet another would be to use the "Bookmark" feature, although I don't recommend it: Bookmarks do not stick across CafeTran sessions, for external projects.


There is one thing that I would like to second though. When you use the "Approved" status in the Target segment editor drop-down list or any other status for that matter, it would indeed be nice to be able to leave the status as is, when needed.


RFE SUGGESTION: 

Igor, here's what I suggest: If Alt+Left or Alt+Right (Move to previous/next segment) is used, do not apply the status when proceeding to next segment, apply it only when segments are also committed to Translation memory. This would make the segment statuses drop-down list a lot more useful.


Finally, a question for you victorparragarcia: With regards to QA, what QA features are you missing in CT?


Jean

Hey Jean, do you have a better way to talk? I mean, like chatting, it's quicker and better for explaining what I need (If you have Hangouts it'd be amazing as I can show you my screen at the same time), then I'll post everything we talk back here for other people with the same issues. I think I just can't explain the issue without screencasting (I want to post a video here, is it possible?). Let me know and if not, I'll try to explain it better through a diagram or whatever :)

Thanks in advance!

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